University of North Carolina Athletics
A Q&A With Coach Marvin Sanders: Part II
July 6, 2004 | Football
By: Joe Bray
TarHeelBlue: You and Coach Gutenkunst are listed as co-coordinators of the defense. How do you anticipate that that will work?
Coach Sanders: "To have a great defense, you have to have input from everybody involved in the system. Gute and I are co-coordinators, but it's a system that we all have bought into, so we work well together.
"We have a system in place where we have a defense that everybody agrees with, and everybody has had input in it. It's not like it's my defense or Gute's defense, it's everybody's defense.
"It's a defense that we started from with a seed, then with everybody's input we've grown so now it's our defense."
TarHeelBlue: If there's a decision that has to be made, obviously John has the ultimate authority, but from a purely defensive coaching staff point of view, will decisions be based more upon consensus?
Coach Sanders: "Yes, it's more of a consensus thing, and Gute would tell you the same thing, because we value Coach Lawing and (Graduate Assistant) Matt House's opinion as much as we value each other's. If I have to make a decision, I'm going to find out what those guys are thinking and usually we're going to be on the same page."
TarHeelBlue: Who's going to be upstairs during games?
Coach Sanders: "I like to be on the field, and I think Gute wants to be there also.
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| Coach Sanders comes to Carolina after a highly successful season at Nebraska. |
Right now we're talking about having Brad and Matt up in the press box.
"Brad will be able to get a better view of both sides of the defensive line from above, it's hard to see both sides of the line down on the field.
"Matt's done a fabulous job as a Graduate Assistant, he understands the defense and I'm very confident in him. If I have a question about what's happening I'm confident that he's going to give me a great answer.
"This isn't set in stone, but right now that's what Gute and I are talking about doing."
TarHeelBlue: Where does motivation come from?
Coach Sanders: "I think that motivation comes with being prepared, believing in what you're doing and enjoying what you're doing. Those three things have to be handled first.
"If you're in business and you're trying to win a big contract and you know there's a big reward at the end, you're probably going to enjoy working like crazy on your proposal, and you'll be really prepared.
"Also, just playing for the University of North Carolina should be enough to motivate a kid. As I look out this window at that beautiful stadium, well, if a kid can't get motivated to play out there, I don't want him playing for me.
"So, I try to make it fun, I try to prepare them to the fullest and get them to believe in what they're doing.
"It's the same way with work. If work isn't fun, if there isn't a light at the end of the tunnel, you lose motivation."
TarHeelBlue: When you're working with a kid, how do you know which buttons to push and how hard to push them?
Coach Sanders: "Every kid is different, and finding which buttons to push is one of the toughest parts of this job. The more you're around a young man, the more you learn about which buttons to push.
"I learned a great deal about motivation from Tom Osborne when I played for him. He did a great job of trying to understand each individual who played for him. I try to take the conversation away from just football, I try to get a young man to come into my office and just talk to me.
"I try to stay away from football. I try to find out how his family is doing, how is his girlfriend doing, what does he like to do on weekends. Those kinds of things will tell you a great deal about a player and how he's going to react to your coaching.
"To get back to Coach Osborne, I did something as a young player that wasn't good. I remember that later I was out on the field stretching when Coach Osborne walked over and said 'Marvin, you know you can't go around doing what you did. You know it was wrong, don't you?'. I said yes. He said 'I don't expect it to happen anymore, right?'. I said 'Yes, sir.'. He never had any more problems out of me. He knew that was all he had to do because he had taken the time to get to know me as a person.
"That's not how he handled everybody. Some guys he may have had to really get on, but he knew how to handle me because he knew about me. He spent more time with me than just as Marvin the football player. So, I try as best as I possibly can to know the guys beyond just as football players.
"Some guys may respond to yelling and screaming, some guys you may have to pull back a little bit and you better know that, or you may lose a young man very fast. At this level you really have to get to know a young man at a personal level, that's how you'll figure out which buttons to push.
"You're not always right, there's a lot of trial and error. As a coach you have to constantly evaluate and reevaluate how you're trying to reach a player.
"If a player isn't responding the first thing I do is not to look at what he has to do differently, but what do I have to do differently to make him a better player. I'm going to exhaust all my possibilities first, then look at what I can do with him. It's my responsibility to adjust first.
"There's more than one way to motivate a player, but it's up to me to find it out, not the player."
TarHeelBlue: What's the most unforgivable thing a player can do out on the field?
Coach Sanders: "Give up, to flat out give up, to quit. I don't care what the score is, I don't care how bad he's beat, I don't care if a guy's thirty yards ahead of him, he better not give up.
"We judge that, we graded every single play in practice this spring on effort. I can handle a kid making a mistake, I can handle a kid missing a tackle, but I will not tolerate a player who gives up, who doesn't give an effort.
"That's in everything, not just on the field. That's in the weight room, the class room, wherever. It doesn't take a 4.4 guy to have effort, it doesn't take a 290 pound guy to give you effort, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to give you effort, it takes a guy who wants to get it done.
"If you get eleven guys to give you that effort, no matter what their talent level, you'll be in every single ballgame. You may not be more talented, but you'll find a way to make something happen.
"I try to stay on as even a keel as possible, but if you don't give me effort, you'll see me get pretty excited."
TarHeelBlue: Are there any particular offensive schemes that drive you crazy as a defensive secondary coach?
Coach Sanders: "The teams that cause you the most problems are the ones that are balanced, the ones that can hurt you as much with the run as the pass. If a team comes at you with just one dimension, you know what to expect.
"Defensive coordinators try to make teams one dimensional, we try to take away the run or the pass. If you can make a team one dimensional you have a better chance at predicting what they're going to do.
"When I look at our offense it scares the dickens out of me as a coordinator. They can put two backs in the backfield and have success running the football, or they can have no backs in the backfield and pass the ball. It's what attack is working for them, they can do it either way.
"Remember the great Florida State offense when Charlie Ward was the quarterback, back in my era. He could run, and they could pass the ball. At Nebraska we could beat people with Tommy Frazier running the option, but he could suck you up with play action and throw it behind you.
"Those are the offenses that scare you to death."
TarHeelBlue: Who's the best defensive back you ever played against?
Coach Sanders: "Deion Sanders. I remember playing against him in the Fiesta Bowl. They were on defense, and I remember him baiting our quarterback. We had a receiver go down the sideline, wide open, and our quarterback, Steve Taylor, scrambled out to his right. It was going to be a throwback, and I saw Deion sitting there. I wondered 'Is he going to be good enough to get back to that ball?'. Sure enough, he got back to the ball.
"I'll tell you what really impressed me about Deion. He had this boisterous, flashy image, but there was a lot more to him than that. I had a teammate who was friends with Deion, and we tried to get him to go out bowling with us one night before the Fiesta Bowl. We went by his hotel room and he had a VCR in there, watching us on film. He watched more film than anybody else on his team. He ended up leaving the bowling alley early to go back and watch more film.
"He's the best because what he did off the field made him a great defensive back. I played against him three times in college, twice in bowl games, and he always understood what our offense was going to do.
"His work ethic and his professionalism really stood out. He also had that attitude you love to see, that 'I'm better than you.' attitude that I love to see in my defensive backs."
TarHeelBlue: Let's talk about the lifeblood of the sport, recruiting. Do you enjoy that part of the job?
Coach Sanders: "It is one of my favorite things to do, because, even though you're trying to sell a young man on your program, you're also helping him to make a decision. I'm selling the University of North Carolina, but I'm also selling the things to look for in college.
"When I sit down one-on-one with a player I tell him about me, I want to hear about him, but I want to help him. The reason I got into coaching is to help young men. You can't get them all to North Carolina, I understand that, but if I help that young man make a good decision, then I feel like I've done my job. I'll give you a perfect example.
"When I was at Nebraska I recruited Lionell Green. We sat down and I told
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| "When I was at Nebraska I recruited Lionell Green. He chose North Carolina. I think it was the best decision for that young man." |
him all the great things about Nebraska. He asked me what did I know about North Carolina. I told him that I knew they had great academics, and that I knew James Webster and he's a great guy. I told him that Chapel Hill's a great community, because I had a good friend from here who was always speaking very highly about the community. I also told him it's one of the greatest universities in the country for minority students.
"He chose Chapel Hill. When he did he called me up and said 'Coach, thank you very much. I'm excited about going to Carolina. When I went there it just seemed like a better fit, and I appreciate your helping me with all of that information.' I was hurt that he didn't come to Nebraska, but when he told me the reasons he chose North Carolina, I was really happy with his decision, because I think it was the best decision for that young man.
"Another thing that I like about recruiting is getting out and visiting with coaches, because I like to learn. There's some great high school coaches in every state who've been at it a long time, guys who've forgotten more than I know. I love to sit down and pick their brains because you can always learn.
"Sometimes I'll visit a coach even if he doesn't have a prospect because I don't know where I'll get that next great coverage from, I don't know where I'll get that next motivational tool. It could come from anywhere. It could come from a coach or even a counselor.
"I enjoy sitting in a prospect's home, getting to know his family. A lot of times a kid may never have had a relative who went to college. That's the way it was with me. I was the youngest of eight kids, and I was the first kid in my family to go to college. When I go sit in a home, I just want them to ask me questions. I want them to know what to expect.
"I can sit there and make everything rosy, and I'm always positive, but above all I'm honest with a kid and his family."
TarHeelBlue: What is your recruiting area?
Coach Sanders: "I've got the Triad area. I've been getting some great feedback from coaches. I'm really interested in the perception of our program by the high school coaches because perception in many cases is reality.
"I'll ask a coach 'How do you think we're doing?'. If they say 'Good.', I'll ask what we're doing well so that we make sure we continue it. If they say 'Bad.', I'll ask what do we need to do to improve.
"It's their kids we're going out recruiting, so we better find out what they're thinking about us. I let them know my door's wide open, feel free to contact me whenever it's permissible.
"One thing we can't forget is how much some of these coaches know. During the spring evaluation period I saw a coach conducting a drill that I really loved. I asked him to send me a tape of the drill, and it's something I'll use with my defensive backs."
TarHeelBlue: Do you think the last couple of years have hurt their perception of the program, or do you think they believe things will turn around?
Coach Sanders: "I think they think we'll turn things around. Despite our record, they've seen the effort our staff has put in recruiting in trying to get the best in-state players to stay in state.
"They know that John has an open-door policy, plus he'll go do clinics everywhere. A lot of them came out in the spring, and we got a lot of compliments from them concerning what we did this spring."
TarHeelBlue: I know you love your job, but all jobs have a down side. What is the most difficult part of being a coach?
Coach Sanders: "Number one is being away from your family so much, especially when you have two young kids like I do. Your family has to be very understanding about the demands of your job.
"The second is seeing a young man within the program who truly needs help, but because of the rules I can't do anything to help him. People think that we're giving a kid a scholarship, and we are, but they forget that many of these kids come from some pretty impoverished situations.
"When I came out of Chicago to go to Nebraska, I didn't get any richer. All
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| Coach Sanders and Gerald Sensabaugh leave the field following the Spring Game. |
Nebraska did is pay for my education. I was still the same, poor Southside-Chicago kid. Now I'm very grateful for that scholarship, but I was still the same poor kid I was before I got there.
"There are some rules that handcuff us so badly. I know they're there and of course we have to follow them, but when I see a kid struggling to eat, that drives me crazy. If I see a John Doe on the street struggling for a meal, I can help him out, but I can't help this kid out who I've been asked to give my blood, sweat and tears to. That eats me alive when I can't do that, it makes me want to scream.
"At Nebraska we had asked our kids to get ready for our first road trip by wearing a shirt and tie and dress shoes. I had a kid come up to me and say 'Hey, coach, I don't have a pair of dress shoes to wear.' I told him that was ok, to just go ahead and wear his gym shoes.
"He said 'Coach, I'm going to be on that plane with all these other guys wearing nice shoes, and I'm going to be embarrassed.' That broke my heart. He had too much pride to ask any of the players for help, so I went to one of our captains and asked him to find someone who could loan him a pair of size-12 dress shoes, which he did.
"I understand those rules are there because of the jerks who have done negative things in our business. Those rules wouldn't be there if there hadn't been guys abusing the rules. It's now my duty to make sure that anybody I'm associated with is doing things right, so that those handcuffs aren't there all the time. Abuse has led to restrictions.
"Another thing that bugs me is that sometimes people think that scholarship athletes are babied and that they get away with things. Our kids face as many demands as regular students. Our athletes should get as much credit for being students as any other students on campus because they're required to go to class, they're required to go to study hall.
"I'd like for people to spend a week in the life of a student-athlete to see how it is. I'm not saying it's any better or any worse, they go through the same rigors as all the other students, especially at a great academic institution such as this one. A student-athlete is going to be a student first here."
TarHeelBlue: A natural follow-up to the last question is what's the best part of being a coach?
Coach Sanders: "I'm glad you asked me that, let me show you something. I received this letter just a while back.
"Seth White was a walk-on player of mine at the University of Nebraska. I'm sure he wouldn't mind my sharing this with you.
"'Dear Coach Sanders,
I wanted to thank you for everything you did for myself and my teammates
during your stay at Nebraska. I've never seen a coach win his team over as fast as
you were able to. Everyone truly loved having you as their coach. I appreciate
all the hard work you put in getting my teammates ready to play every week. It is
obvious to me that you have figured out a formula for success. I look forward to
following you through your career.'"
"That's what makes it all worth it. This is a young man who had played maybe ten snaps in thirteen games at most, yet he wrote me this letter.
"Guys like Seth White are what keep me in it. The stars are easy, but when you get through to the Seth White's, you know you're treating everybody equally.
"I'll keep doing this job for as long as I can if for no other reason than that letter."
